Champions League Final 2011

Discussion about European club leagues, Champions League and anything in UEFA

Who will win the 2011 Champions League Final?

Manchester United
5
33%
Barcelona
10
67%
 
Total votes: 15

fir_nev
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Post by fir_nev » 30 May 2011, 00:13

TheBrilliance wrote:Barca are leaps and bounds over any other team going round. No one can seem to match them for quality at the moment.

You know they annoy me with their on field antics, and Im still aware to this conspiracy, but their squad just goes to show what more teams need to do and owners need to understand in terms of winning.

Barca do not have the best players, but the RIGHT players. By all means Messi, Xavi, Iniesta, Villa are all proven world class players, but players like Busquets, Valdes and even Alves and Pedro are not in that catergory by any means. You could replace them with superstars from other sides but they might not fit the package.

Its obvious that these kind of players fit into this team perfectly, have been nurtured perfectly and will become legends without really being world beaters.

Very similar to a Liverpool team in the 80's that are very similar to the Barca today. The players their have become legends. Solid spines of teams are necessary but the additions need to be the right players, not necessarily the best. If you have talent, workrate and a desire to play for the you have more chance than a Balotelli ever being called up.

Barca and Liverpool go a step further because they have their cake made to perfection and have a big juicy cherry on top being Messi, Dalglish etc.

I feel Barca could win as much without the best player in the world. Have a look at the Spanish side.

So what I am saying is that right players rather than the best will win you silverware. Take note The Man Citehs and Chel$kis of the world.

An ideal squad IMHO would consist of 20-22 squad players, experienced players, who will most likely get action due to the squad not having 40 players full of dead woods. If injuries occur youth should step in. Brood baby Brood!
I have to agree. Seeing Valdes, Xavi, Iniesta, Pedro, Messi all coming out from the youth system, I really do not see Barca losing steam in years to come.

Eric Abidal and Mascherano fit nicely into the current tactics being used. When they bought David Villa, I was pulling my hair as he is very well the final piece of the puzzle for the European champions.

Dear oh dear. How do we stop them?!
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nick117
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Post by nick117 » 30 May 2011, 00:15

I really want to see how madrid deal with them next year after all mou will have probably built his team into his idea of "perfection" by the end of this summer then they have to gel.

TheBrilliance
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Post by TheBrilliance » 30 May 2011, 07:24

Mourinho is smart. He will purchase good players, but make sure they fit into the system.

I like Madrid more than Barca, but at the moment they are not going to get close.

panchester07
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Post by panchester07 » 30 May 2011, 14:18

Barca is leapes ahead of everybody, but they fu**in bleed, and if they bleed they can be killed damn it -

Yes they raped united, and they didn't use lubricant will doing it, but did everybody forget the first league game vs Madrid in Bernabeu- Mourinho found the recipe to play against this super-duper-trooper- team--

He was criticized by everybody, but Madrid being a team of warriors, and being known for their never give up spirit actually played vs Barca with 10 and tied the match -

Then, in the Cup final, they found the way to create MORE chances than super-barca, playing ultradeffensive and counterattacking quickly, and beat Barcelona -

In the first 60 minutes, with Pepe ON the field, the game was 50-50, yes barca had the ball and all the posession they want, but they didn't have any clear chances that you would say WUFF- damn that was close -

Then what happens, Pepe gets a red, and Barca wins 0-2, don't fuckni telll me the red didn't affect the game, because it did, with Pepe on the field, there wasn't any team better than the other one -

Then, Madrid goes to Camp Nou, needing to win, so they play a 4-2-3-1, an attacking formation, and Barca totally schools them completely - Like they did in November, like they did vs Man United in the final -

Anyone see a pattern here?

If you park the buss against this super-barka, you can give them a hard time and beat them - Yes its not beautiful, but its a tactic and a style, and so is posession and tiki-taka so don't come here with your romantic bs -

Ferguson got whipped in Roma, and should have learnt from his mistakes, but he did the same exact thing, Manchester United is a brilliant team, the best in the world, but Barca is from out of this Universe and you just can't line up an attacking formation against them because you NEVER have the ball - Park the bus, pressure them clusterfuck the midfield, see Madrid, Inter, Hercules, Rubin Kazaan, Switzerland(vs Spain)- It can be done, and even non world class teams like Rubin Kazaan and Hercules have achieved it, you just need to get the tactic right, and soon you will suceed -

All the people out there who criticize Mourinho and his defensive style 8vs barca), are actually insecure Barca fans afraid that a team and a manager actually found the way to give them a hard time -

Mourinho was right all this time, Di Stefano criticized him, Cruyff criticized him, half of Madridistas criticized him, but the man's job is to win, and if you weigh on a scale, playing counterattack, defensively, and pressing, (not true to your team's history), but have a chance to win, and playing ofensively, but getting 5 goals in, i sure as hell rather the first option - thhough a few might criticize, i didn't see Madrid fan's pissed when Iker raised the cup -

The excuses and conspiracy side of him sucks balls, but he's a brilliant manager and figured out the way to stop this beast

I'm sure many can agree i'm not full of sh*t - and actually making a serious and valid point here-
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soccer11
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Post by soccer11 » 30 May 2011, 16:36

Completely agree with you Panchester. Mourinho is one of the few managers who has beaten Barcelona on multiple occasions. He knows the formula, but even with the formula, it's still a tough task because of how good Barcelona are. And the scary thing is, all of Barcelona seem to be in their prime still, for the most part at least. (Puyol might be on the way down.)

I've been saying it for a few years now. I believe Mourinho will be the next manager of Manchester United. He has always said he wants to go back to the EPL and that he misses English football. For a team like United, we need a big personality as manager. He's always had a good relationship with Sir Alex. He'll vouch for Mourinho. I think Sir Alex will retire in the next couple years, around the same time I believe Mourinho will leave Madrid/ Madrid will get rid of Mourinho.
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Post by styale18 » 30 May 2011, 17:34

you are completely correct but i would just like to add that arsenal also beat and drew them last year without parking the bus. I think barca would also struggle more against teams who play like them, like arsenal

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Post by panchester07 » 30 May 2011, 17:47

styale18 wrote:you are completely correct but i would just like to add that arsenal also beat and drew them last year without parking the bus. I think barca would also struggle more against teams who play like them, like arsenal
that is actually fire with fire, and its suicidial, why? because the "possesion" tactic is best executed by barcelona by far, arsenal can play similar to them, and so can villareal and other teams around, but obviously the best team to play possesion and tiki-taka are barca, so they will beat you-

the uncalled goal in emirates, a few clear cut chances, that barca missed, and the valdes blooper, face it, barca WAS better for the vast mayority of the time, and had more chances, a few moments of inspiration made the score be 2-1, a mistake, many missed chances, an uncalled goal, and the support of 50,000 screaming fans- What happened in Camp Nou? Arsenal didn't take a shot on goal, their only goal was scored by Busquets, and Barca toyed them-

Do I make sense?
Completely agree with you Panchester
Cheers mate !

How would have this line up looked?


Fabio - Ferdinand - Vidic - Evra


Park - Smalling - Carrick


Valencia - Wayne - Nani



The line of 4, 3 defensive midfielders and Valencia Wayne and Nani to press the defense and try and get a goal, very similar to the Madrid line up that beat Barcelona well beaten in the cup final :


Marcelo - Carvalho - Ramos- Arbeloa

Khedira - Pepe - Xabi Alonso


Ozeil - Ronaldo - Di Maria

The line of 4 and 3 contain, defend and don't let them breathe, the top 3 run their asses off and try to get a mistake from the defenders, and stuff like that, they DIDN'T let them play -
to know Him is to want to know Him more"


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styale18
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Post by styale18 » 30 May 2011, 17:59

yeah you are but im just saying in the second halves of both of the first legs, they were more positive, which led to them coming back: thats my point.

EDIT: not every team will be clinical and finish all their chances so that doesn't matter

klc123
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Post by klc123 » 30 May 2011, 20:37

The only reason Arsenal stood a chance against Barcelona was because Barcelona played poorly against them and were off form, as well as making many mistakes more than they normally make in an entire season.

The only way to play them is to use Counter-attacking football, and Real Madrid are the best team in the world at that. That is the reason they were able to beat them in the copa del rey.

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Post by shahensha » 31 May 2011, 03:18

I think Valdes proved he is very good at dealing with counter-attacks. His acrobatic flying punches were awesome when Man United tried long balls :lol:

I relish the idea of facing Mourinho next season. Even he has claimed that his teams are better in his second season. If Guardiola pulls off 4 straight La Ligas in a row, just like Cruyff, then that will be amazing, and especially against Mourinho of all managers........Visca El Barca. Golden Pep all day.
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TheBrilliance
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Post by TheBrilliance » 31 May 2011, 04:56

panchester07 wrote:Barca is leapes ahead of everybody, but they fu**in bleed, and if they bleed they can be killed damn it -

Yes they raped united, and they didn't use lubricant will doing it, but did everybody forget the first league game vs Madrid in Bernabeu- Mourinho found the recipe to play against this super-duper-trooper- team--

He was criticized by everybody, but Madrid being a team of warriors, and being known for their never give up spirit actually played vs Barca with 10 and tied the match -

Then, in the Cup final, they found the way to create MORE chances than super-barca, playing ultradeffensive and counterattacking quickly, and beat Barcelona -

In the first 60 minutes, with Pepe ON the field, the game was 50-50, yes barca had the ball and all the posession they want, but they didn't have any clear chances that you would say WUFF- damn that was close -

Then what happens, Pepe gets a red, and Barca wins 0-2, don't fuckni telll me the red didn't affect the game, because it did, with Pepe on the field, there wasn't any team better than the other one -

Then, Madrid goes to Camp Nou, needing to win, so they play a 4-2-3-1, an attacking formation, and Barca totally schools them completely - Like they did in November, like they did vs Man United in the final -

Anyone see a pattern here?

If you park the buss against this super-barka, you can give them a hard time and beat them - Yes its not beautiful, but its a tactic and a style, and so is posession and tiki-taka so don't come here with your romantic bs -

Ferguson got whipped in Roma, and should have learnt from his mistakes, but he did the same exact thing, Manchester United is a brilliant team, the best in the world, but Barca is from out of this Universe and you just can't line up an attacking formation against them because you NEVER have the ball - Park the bus, pressure them clusterfuck the midfield, see Madrid, Inter, Hercules, Rubin Kazaan, Switzerland(vs Spain)- It can be done, and even non world class teams like Rubin Kazaan and Hercules have achieved it, you just need to get the tactic right, and soon you will suceed -

All the people out there who criticize Mourinho and his defensive style 8vs barca), are actually insecure Barca fans afraid that a team and a manager actually found the way to give them a hard time -

Mourinho was right all this time, Di Stefano criticized him, Cruyff criticized him, half of Madridistas criticized him, but the man's job is to win, and if you weigh on a scale, playing counterattack, defensively, and pressing, (not true to your team's history), but have a chance to win, and playing ofensively, but getting 5 goals in, i sure as hell rather the first option - thhough a few might criticize, i didn't see Madrid fan's pissed when Iker raised the cup -

The excuses and conspiracy side of him sucks balls, but he's a brilliant manager and figured out the way to stop this beast

I'm sure many can agree i'm not full of sh*t - and actually making a serious and valid point here-
Someone give me rating priveleges, because this a great post. I understand how Barca have made a team of their quality. I know how they can be beaten too, which is what i enjoy. Alot. Panch has summed it up here AND MORE. Great post.

Mate im interested in your opinion here. I was surprised Man U played Carrick and Giggs together in midfield. I feel Fletcher and Scholes are your best choice in midfield by far. I rate Anderson over Carrick aswell. MC can pass, but.....thats it really.

The Arsenal game was very much a fight fire with fire. Jack Wilshere could slot into that Barca team nicely, as could Fabregas. Arsenal just were a better side and Barca were not at the Camp Nou.

Anyway Barca got what they wanted with RVP sent off next game cheaply :P

nick117
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Post by nick117 » 31 May 2011, 05:04

fletch wasn't fit and scholes isn't quite ready to run with barca not to mention his tackling... scholes isn't known to stay on the field.

shahensha
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Post by shahensha » 31 May 2011, 05:10

Its not like Mourinho is the first person to use the park the bus and counter strategy. Everyone has been doing it for many years. I dont particularly remember Man United being very attack minded in semi-final against Barcelona in 2008 or Chelsea in 2009

Its just that Mourinho has the money and expense to pull this off with a great world class squad. Also with Jorge Valdano's firing, Mourinho has COMPLETE control, which is why I cant wait to see what happens next season. Pep will continue his talking on the pitch no matter what. Visca El Barca y Visca Guardiola!


Here is a video where someone decided to analyze the game because they have too much time on their hands, which works out perfectly for us.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDsGMt0M ... r_embedded
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panchester07
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Post by panchester07 » 31 May 2011, 06:56

yeah i agree, as i said in my post, quite a few teams before mourinho figured out the playing style that defeated this super barca, mou is a famous case, but there are smaller sides like rubin kazan and hercule that have surprised barcelona in the past the russians, i think, before mou did - and i'm to lazy to research and analyze but there have to be more cases - now the Mou won in the Cup of del Rey was notorious because they created more chances than Barcelona and could have been up in the first half by a few goals, specially Pepe's post but a few other situations - it was also the first time in a long while before real finally beat the super Pep-Team

even though it might be good for my tactical knowledge overall, i can't watch that video, it was too painfull too watch my team suffer the first time, not to mention now watching the rerun and analysis of th ass-whooping :(
to know Him is to want to know Him more"


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Tocar y moverse y tratarla siempre muy muy bien..'

TheBrilliance
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Post by TheBrilliance » 31 May 2011, 11:40

Id like to see a team go at them. With no fear, instead of parking the bus.

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