Possesion Obssesion

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NewBornProdigy
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Possesion Obssesion

Post by NewBornProdigy » 26 Sep 2008, 20:45

*disclaimer*

this my opinion and something that is really bothering me recently, so any opinions would be appreciated


Western Civillastion and its Consumerism

Nowadays money is everything, as humans we are naturally prone to obsessing and habits, but also to curiousity and perfection
Most people consider perfection as the biggest plasma screen on the block
At the beginning of our species this was not such a bad thing as it encouraged us to grow, develop and explore as a civilisation
pretty soon with our advanced ability to dream and imagine we took over the world, we invented clothes, cars and computers
we lived a dream, that was to be civilzed
and cash was central to that

Now at the peak of the worlds power money is the root of all problems
we are too smart, too greedy, too careless.
our own scientist's have come up with ways of tricking us into buying produce, called advertising
the drive for perfection has become a drive for greed
we have no purpose in life, not special place in history
we just get educated for a future life, yet never really learn to live
we work for money for our material wishes, yet we do not need them to enjoy ourselves

we are pressured into working jobs we hate for excessive amounts of money that we don't need

Advertising has us chasing and clothes, working jobs we hate for sh*t we don't need, our bodies are in a world of wealth, but our minds are in a prision of desire and greed
our modern society only functions on the material demand
our super-corparations would buckle and collapse without the demand for what they sell, but there genius advertising has us in a cage
our conseince is full of venom and rage

We live life overshopping and never reaching our expectations or desires
we all yearn for eternal happieness
we all beleive eternal happieness is in the store down the road
Happiness is an emotions, all emotions come from the mind and are triggered in the mind
your possesions will never leave you with a lasting happiness

our obsession is getting out of hand, when one want is fufilled we want another one, our greed makes always want more
we cannot be content with what we have, which well over enough
no pleasure lasts forever so we always want more, which will bring us more temporary satisfaction
they are the focal point of our lives, and its pathetic
to get something we want, we need money and a job
we do a job out of labour not enjoyment, working for the things we want
the things you own end up owning you

Murder, Crime, Poverty these things don't bother me
celebrity magazines, see-through tables and yellow cars?

People with freedom of finance, Seem to lack freedom of mind

We need to ask ourselves 'What do I want to be?' and just go for it
ignore all your fears and distractions, letting that which does not matter truly slide
we need to forget about what we want and what we think we want
and work toward something that would make us content and happy in life
If you wanna be a doctor, forget about watching family guy or going out clubbing on a school night
JUST RUN WITH IT, become what you want to be
instead of wasting your life trying to buy happiness in Hugo Boss

Everyone wants to be rich beyond all beleif, but when reality kicks in
YOU ARE NOT SPECIAL, the only way you become special is by doing something SPEACIAL
Its easy to live off daddy and grow up being and angry spoiled little sh*t who winges about his fancy office job in daddy's company
You could work hard, become a race driver
You could Train hard, become a footballer
You could Study hard, become a Lawyer
Doing this is special
the whole world is your stage, become legendary....
....or nothing

Never will you reach your dream by sitting, watching and waiting for and email from Alex Ferguson on your $999 Labtop

In live we all want and need freedom, everything we do is sorced around getting freedom, we work to be finacially free of worries, but money has began to choke our freedom, we are so much into money we have lost our will to think
to get free from our greed we need to lose everything, and look at life in the point of view that we have nothing to lose and anything to gain
to become something you will need to start as nothing

love for money will tempt you into doing evil





its open to discussion but this is what think money has done to the mentality of the people...
this is my view on how we should let ourselves go a become free from the financial pressures of modern society
this basically is a way i look at life and money and how to be happy
there are of course alternatives, and if anyone has a view please write it down
Image

SteveF
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Post by SteveF » 30 Sep 2008, 09:07

man this is a very well thought article
just we all couldn't possibly live by this philosiphy?
we need an alternate because everything from our enconmy to our saftey would collaspe

i can't imagine a world without greed, because in a way we need greed

WooWee55
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Post by WooWee55 » 30 Sep 2008, 13:14

bro you should so make that into a rap!!! and i like the quote from Fight Club also :D

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Post by mattmarenic » 03 Oct 2008, 07:52

I think this is nothing new. Western civilzation has always act like this...

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Post by expert » 03 Oct 2008, 08:44

Interesting theory although I have a few issues with it.
People with freedom of finance, Seem to lack freedom of mind
I don't know about that. The less money you have the more dependent you'll be on others which will limit your freedom.
JUST RUN WITH IT, become what you want to be
the whole world is your stage, become legendary....
....or nothing
I think the jist of what your saying is a bit unrealistic. Nobody has that kind of control over their life. In my experience things just happen regardless of what your plans are, and you can either adapt or re-evaluate your goals.
love for money will tempt you into doing evil
I would point out that not only love of money, but any other form of fanaticism will tempt you into doing 'evil'. And this includes football which most people on here are fanatical about. :) By the way, I think it's pointless to categorize any action as 'evil', but I digress.
this basically is a way i look at life and money and how to be happy
Happiness is overrated. If I wanted to be happy I would do nothing all day long except getting wasted and eating ice cream. What I'm saying is that happiness should not even be part of this discussion.

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Post by iwannagopro » 03 Oct 2008, 10:35

expert wrote: Happiness is overrated. If I wanted to be happy I would do nothing all day long except getting wasted and eating ice cream. What I'm saying is that happiness should not even be part of this discussion.
Oh sh*t.

Why didn't I think of that before.

Be right back, getting ice cream and vodka.

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Post by NewBornProdigy » 03 Oct 2008, 20:05

expert wrote:
People with freedom of finance, Seem to lack freedom of mind
I don't know about that. The less money you have the more dependent you'll be on others which will limit your freedom.


Ok i didn't quite express this clearly enough...
Freedom of finance was meant as having so much money that they could buy anything
Freedom of mind was meant as having such freedom of will they could bring themselves to try anything

i do not mean forget about money, you won't need it, you will always need it, but people have detacthed thier whole lives in getting money and greed... but are never satisfiyed

they are not content with what they have, and have no aim but to get more than they need, so they never will become content
i think to be happy you need to be content, to be content you need to be free, to be free you need to be pure at mind, to be free at mind you need to have will-power against temptation

you are right that you can't depend on people to live life freely, but you can't depend on money to enjoy life freely
you have to grow up and get independent, get a job that you like, and live...

freedom is not in material form, it is a feeling an emotion that your can do anything and everything... in life we always struggle for freedom... freedom of finance, freedom of speech and freedom to make toast for breakfast... everything is about freedom and getting it
and when we can't see that with the chokehold of money we are not free, we are not freely content to think what we want to think instead our lives are polutted with thoughts of material wishes

To gain freedom you must first realise YOUR FAULTS... you must awaken yourself. This is the most difficult part. The change is a change in you. freedom is the condition of liberation. In order to liberate yourself you must be free.
that the first step in liberation is that you perceive that your situation is unjust. This already is the inner freedom... but to be free you have to express to yourself that you can deny urges or command's of temptations

and when you are liberated you have unlimited options in life
expert wrote:
JUST RUN WITH IT, become what you want to be
the whole world is your stage, become legendary....
....or nothing

I think the jist of what your saying is a bit unrealistic. Nobody has that kind of control over their life. In my experience things just happen regardless of what your plans are, and you can either adapt or re-evaluate your goals
.

the problem is people fear too much, they are not ready to accept that there is nothing they can't do... but they are to scared to go out and just go for it, go become what they want to be...
they are to scared of losing something that the modern world has tricked them into thinking is important...
they are scared of losing possesion's or money...
It's only after we've lost everything, are we free to do ANYTHING

but we are not readily free enough to see or accept that

instead of re-evaluating your goals and living a life of a broken dream, just run with it and live it
expert wrote:
love for money will tempt you into doing evil

I would point out that not only love of money, but any other form of fanaticism will tempt you into doing 'evil'. And this includes football which most people on here are fanatical about. By the way, I think it's pointless to categorize any action as 'evil', but I digress.


you have me there :wink:

yeah mabye evil was a bit of a strong word

but cash intices greed and injustice alot worse than football does in all honesty
expert wrote:
this basically is a way i look at life and money and how to be happy
Happiness is overrated. If I wanted to be happy I would do nothing all day long except getting wasted and eating ice cream. What I'm saying is that happiness should not even be part of this discussion.
Happiness is central to this argument, it is Philosophy, and central to life is happiness, and you do not achive happiness by sitting around being all comfy in a big armchair and eating and ice cream..
people always mistake comfort and happiness as the same thing

you are happy when you are content, you are content when you achive something
eg. you score a winning goal, you feel comfortable? no... you feel proud, happy and content because all your hard work has lead to success

happiness like anything is a result of hard work, thats why the reward of the most beautiful feeling of satisfaction and pride is the reward

and if you are not free enough to realise when comfort buying and comfort eating will not make you happy, you are in trouble mate

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Post by expert » 05 Oct 2008, 08:46

NewBornProdigy wrote:Freedom of finance was meant as having so much money that they could buy anything
Freedom of mind was meant as having such freedom of will they could bring themselves to try anything
The two are interrelated I think. People with money can afford to experience and try a lot of different things which others can't. You are making the assumption that having a lot of money corrupts your mind somehow. Also, what if my ultimate goal in life IS to make a lot money and it makes me happy? :)
NewBornProdigy wrote:the problem is people fear too much, they are not ready to accept that there is nothing they can't do...
I don't know about that. We are NOT all equal and I can support this clam inductively. For example, everybody on EF wants to be pro, but 99.9% will never be pro. Don't say "they will fail because they are not 'free'" because that is also an assumption - not proof.
NewBornProdigy wrote:but cash intices greed and injustice alot worse than football does in all honesty
I think that's just another part of human nature. The only difference is that money is more socially significant than football in the world (in fact money runs football). My point was, you are talking about freedom from urges and obsessions, but football is also an obsession.
NewBornProdigy wrote:people always mistake comfort and happiness as the same thing
you are happy when you are content, you are content when you achive something
You need to clarify this argument a little bit.
It seems that you are making another assumption here, that a person can ONLY be happy when he achieves something. Why can't I be 'happy' when doing nothing but sitting around.
I'm afraid we're in the tragic position where we can never ATTAIN happiness. Let's say you reach your most important goal. As soon as the thing you were striving for is in your grasp, it will no longer make you happy and you start craving other things. This is an old religious argument and there is some truth in it, regarding the ephemeral nature of happiness.
Happiness is unattainable so I say leave out of your theory. Leave out the part that we are all equal, that money itself is evil, in fact leave out the idea of evil itself and THEN we have something potent left.

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Post by Nat_H » 05 Oct 2008, 10:28

I really don't wanna get into this, but to clarify:

--Happiness is temporal good-feeling, e.g. happy because you got $20 for your birthday...happy because you got a girlfriend...etc.

--Joyfulness is good-feeling that is grounded in something eternal/immutable, e.g. joyful because you know you're made by God...joyful because you are free from sin...etc.

So because happiness is grounded in temporal things, that happiness WILL eventually lose its roots. Joyfulness on the other hand, won't lose its roots. It is possible to no longer find joy in life, but it that's just losing your focus on what is important.

Forgive my using "religious" examples in my description of joy, but I believe that only a believer in Christ can experience true joy. Maybe you don't understand it, but let me tell you that through my experience (and other's), you cannot find joy anywhere else. Think about it: what in the world (or out of it), do you believe is eternal or immutable? Only that can be a source of unending happiness: joyfulness.

Happiness is fine, but, (like others have said) it is a drug. You get high on happiness for two days and then crash and burn. I too know this from experience. It's not that you can't find or attain happiness, it's that it is temporal and does not last beyond lost expectations.

"True happiness" is joyfulness

My $0.02 on this. I could get into a lot more about the nature of evil and greed, but I know you guys don't want me to do that...lol :o

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Post by expert » 05 Oct 2008, 15:00

I agree with the first part of what you said.
Nat_H wrote:I believe that only a believer in Christ can experience true joy. Maybe you don't understand it, but let me tell you that through my experience (and other's), you cannot find joy anywhere else
You are eluding mythical experiences which seem deep but are in reality less than superficial.
Nat_H wrote:Think about it: what in the world (or out of it), do you believe is eternal or immutable?
The truth.

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Post by Rocky » 05 Oct 2008, 15:34

Happiness and joy, in my opinion, is when you succeed.
If you can imagine it, you can achieve it; if you can dream it, you can become it.

First say to yourself what you would be, and then do what you have to do.

What the mind of man can concieve and believe, it can achieve.

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Post by iwannagopro » 05 Oct 2008, 15:38

expert wrote:I agree with the first part of what you said.
Nat_H wrote:I believe that only a believer in Christ can experience true joy. Maybe you don't understand it, but let me tell you that through my experience (and other's), you cannot find joy anywhere else
You are eluding mythical experiences which seem deep but are in reality less than superficial.
Nat_H wrote:Think about it: what in the world (or out of it), do you believe is eternal or immutable?
The truth.
Word.

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Post by NewBornProdigy » 05 Oct 2008, 17:08

expert wrote:The two are interrelated I think. People with money can afford to experience and try a lot of different things which others can't. You are making the assumption that having a lot of money corrupts your mind somehow. Also, what if my ultimate goal in life IS to make a lot money and it makes me happy?
i can see where your your coming from
money gives you finacial freedom, so you can buy loads of stuff

but what i wanted to say (before nat beat me to it) was that comfort is temporary, but contentment isn't
comfort is brought by pleasure and experience
so indeed if you have loads of cash you can have loads of comfortable momments... but your never spiritually free
MONEY does coruppt peoples mind
it cause's them to worry, they worry about what they have, what they own
and are afraid to lose it all without their money
it also means when you get 1,000,000 dollars you think i'm set up for life, then slowly this wanes away and you only got 100,000 left
then people start to worry and want more
greed takes over, cause the feeling of plaesure has faded you want more... so greed kicks in

eg. you only want an ice-cream because it taste's nice, not cause you are hungry

there is nothing wrong with having pleasure and comfort in life
but people get so obbsesed with it, the comfort and pleasure corrupts them, because of their greed to have so much of it

so if your goal in life is to make loads of money, you will have loads of pleasure and no happiness, so when the novelty of a new car wears off you will want a new one

its the same as saying 'my goal in life is to smoke crack'

you will live a very happy life, but when the crack wears off, you want more, till eventually it ruins your way of thinking... all you want is to get more crack to satisfy your urges
sexpert wrote:I don't know about that. We are NOT all equal and I can support this clam inductively. For example, everybody on EF wants to be pro, but 99.9% will never be pro. Don't say "they will fail because they are not 'free'" because that is also an assumption - not proof
so 99% want to be pro... ok some will be way past it, too old or simply not good enough

but lets pretend there are 2, 12 year olds, both average at the beautiful game, the differnce one is rich (from America for example)
th other is poor (from brazil)

the boy from america spends 2 hours playing with friends but goes inside at 6 to watch simpsons and goes to school during the day... he gets good at football but not good enough

the boy from brazil can't sfford the fancy boots the american kid has, he can only play in trainers
he play's for 6 hours a day cause he doesn't own a t.v. or and education

the boy from brazil does not have the luxury in life we have... he has only got 1 shot to make a decent life for himself
where we have an education and countless luxuries as kids

he has nothing, so he is free to do anything
we have everything, but were scared to lose anything

harsh but true
expert wrote:think that's just another part of human nature. The only difference is that money is more socially significant than football in the world (in fact money runs football). My point was, you are talking about freedom from urges and obsessions, but football is also an obsession
football is different than money

eg. if someone finds god they have happiness
if someone gets scouted they find happiness
if someone finds a million dollars they find temporay joy and pleasure

a preist is happy with what he is... he is content
a footballer is satisfiyed with what he is... he is content
a lotto winner is happy with their life, until the money runs out

(in saying that money has coruppted preists and more recently footballers, many, many times)

money is essntial for life, it is alright to work to make money
but some people live to make money, sleep to make money but never enjoy life without it
expert wrote:You need to clarify this argument a little bit.
It seems that you are making another assumption here, that a person can ONLY be happy when he achieves something. Why can't I be 'happy' when doing nothing but sitting around.
I'm afraid we're in the tragic position where we can never ATTAIN happiness. Let's say you reach your most important goal. As soon as the thing you were striving for is in your grasp, it will no longer make you happy and you start craving other things. This is an old religious argument and there is some truth in it, regarding the ephemeral nature of happiness.
Happiness is unattainable so I say leave out of your theory. Leave out the part that we are all equal, that money itself is evil, in fact leave out the idea of evil itself and THEN we have something potent left
ok i'll clarify it, cause its pretty hard to understand the way it is now :wink:

pleasure and comfort are the tempory feelings (caused by a drug called endorphin or something)
these are good in steady doses but like all drug's its bad to get too addicted to feeling good
and like all drugs the feeling doesn't last forever

it is a feeling that is sparked by physical joys
(eg. a funny joke, a wank, a new car or nice food)

happiness (mabye i should call them all forms of happiness, excuse the confusion)

contentment are the satisfiying feelings of pride (dunno what the fu** cause's this)
this is good for your self-estem and your mental health, but is very rare to come across

it is sparked by emotional joys
(eg. achieving a dream, falling in love, findind salvation or liberating your country)

you need both in moderation, but too much can lead to over-indulgence and the novelty of happiness wears off

but say finding god leaves you content with life
over finding a fiver leaves you happy for the few minutes a cholcolate bar last's

we are to easily caught up in addiction and obsession
as human beings its our one fatal flaw



so its not happiness but contentment we must look for
but so often we aren't 'free willed' enough to forget about all our material wishes
and chase our spiritual dream

and we are all born equal, but what we do in life shapes our futures

its love for money that is evil... its called greed

and i think now its a bit more potent...
i'd like to hear more, cause at 26 your 11 years more experienced than me
basically i value your opinion

and as for Nat, if he beleives in christ so strongly he has clearly found the spirtual joy so many other lack

Nat i would love if you went into your opinions on evil and greed...
whole reason i wrote this, to see the mixed opinions

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Post by Nat_H » 05 Oct 2008, 17:21

expert wrote:
Nat_H wrote:Think about it: what in the world (or out of it), do you believe is eternal or immutable?
The truth.
Good answer, but that is exactly what Jesus Christ claimed to be:
"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me"

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Post by iwannagopro » 05 Oct 2008, 18:39

Nat_H wrote:
expert wrote:
Nat_H wrote:Think about it: what in the world (or out of it), do you believe is eternal or immutable?
The truth.
Good answer, but that is exactly what Jesus Christ claimed to be:
"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me"
Doesn't mean that he is the only truth.

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